One of standup comedy, performance art, film and TV’s most groundsbreaking and influential artists, Sandra Bernhard reftlects on the state of comedy and media, various people and projects from her iconic career, and 20 years of New Years Eve parties at Joe’s Pub.
Thotyssey: Sandra, hello! Thanks so much for finding a moment to speak with us! I understand you are currently filming the next season of White Lotus, and I have 600 questions about that… which of course you can’t answer, lol. But I was just wondering in general, do you find the process of filming a series today compared to, like, 30 years ago to be an extremely different animal, or still fundamentally the same?
Sandra Bernhard: Excellent question! First, let me tell you about every single scene I’m in in White Lotus… just kidding! Of course, everything has changed–starting with the over awareness of every little detail, from the casting to the day a project comes out. Most of the magic has been sucked dry due to social media and all the people who think they’re in the know. This, to me, is the biggest and most upsetting aspect of how the business has changed.
It was really fun to see you pop up in Marty Supreme last year, but… I was just left wanting more scenes with both you and Fran Drescher! You two are such strong New York personalities (even though you’re from Michigan and spent much of your come-up in LA, we still see you as one of ours). I was just wondering if you know Fran well off-camera, and if you have any stories about the Marty set?
It was really the first time I had worked or hung out with Fran. The scene was shot late at night on the last day of filming. I wish we had more on screen time together; we really hit it off. Not unlike the film itself, there was a very fast pace energy on the set–and they were trying to get in as much as they could on that snowy December night.
You’ve been hosting Sandyland on Radio Andy SiriusXM for over a decade, an extraordinary accomplishment. That is more of a traditional live / call-in radio show with in-studio guests–unlike most podcasts, which are widely streamed after recording. The state of media is so in flux now! You of course been an epic TV talk show guest over the decades, and even hosted your own cable talk show on A&E at one point. Is that part of the business dead and dying, and audio / streaming will be the forever home of conversational platforms going forward?
I think all bets are off for the way we knew TV. There are endless voices talking over each other on social media, so the few that break through are rare. I bring myself to Sandlyand and really don’t have many expectations. It’s nice to connect with people in the moment the way I do in my live shows, but how much impact it has is up for debate.
Do you have all-time favorite Sandyland guests?
Of course: Lily Tomlin and Jane Fonda, Gloria Steinem, Bette Midler… some of my big influences have been highlights. In terms of important conversations, Lizz Winstead is one of my favorites.
I had a roommate who was obsessed with your comedy specials, and in particular we watched 1988’s Without You I’m Nothing many times. That was so groundbreaking because it was your comedy, your dishy storytelling, your live singing and, of course, your epic near-nude dance to “Little Red Corvette.” Nobody in the mainstream at the time was incorporating all of that in quite that way. What inspired you to combine all your talents and make it into a stage show like that?
Growing up on these entertainers as mainstream might have influenced me in major ways: Carol Channing, Carol Burnett, Liza, Mary Tyler Moore, The Supremes, Mama Cass, Cher, The Rolling Stones, and Tina Turner. They were all people who I studied along with comics when I was growing up. People did it all… and because I could, so did I.
I remember you once on Howard Stern describing a key difference between you and fellow comic Kathy Griffin, who is also known for telling stories about absurd Hollywood off-camera behavior. You basically said that in Kathy’s act, her storytelling was the whole thing… while for you, it tied into larger, more relatable and philosophical material. Is it still important for you to make your comedy “about” something or is it ever okay to just get on stage and tell some easy, crowd-pleasing jokes about smartphones and supermarkets?
That’s just not in my wheel house. I think a lot about the world and culture, and how it ebbs and flows. So because of that, my material is layered with nuance,. emotion and concern… along with being funny and entertaining. It has to resonate with me, and therefore I hope, with my audience.
This seems like the question everyone is still asking about standup today: should comics “apologize” for old material that fans might find offensive today? I know some of your controversial Mariah Carey material from the 90s has made the social media rounds again, and online folks have strong opinions about it. People change and cultural sensibilities change with time, but should artists be attached to their old material forever?
It depends, of course. I was coming from a place of being highly connected and influenced by my mentor Paul Mooney, who brought me into the fold. It was a different time, and as a social critic I took liberties that one can no longer take. There’s not much else to say about it without sounding half crazy, so I won’t blather on.
Recently singer Ed Sheeran got globally roasted for being wishy-washy about Israel and Palestine, even while his opener Macklemore got fired for saying “Free Palestine” live onstage. Your own public take on the conflict in that region has been more nuanced, in large part due to your own history with Israel. Persobally, I still don’t quite know what to feel about artists feeling forced or being trapped into making political statements. But do you think everyone with a platform should be using it to voice their opinions about big things, if doing so could lead to a greater good?
The bottom line is, no one wants to see an entire society destroyed… or at least I don’t. I am incredibly shocked at what has happened to the Palestinian people, and the rampant violence on the part of Israel. Netanyahu is hanging on by a thread, and most likely will never face prosecution on his corruption. [Terrorist organization Hamas’ attacks on Israeli citizens on] October 7 could have been avoided, but he chose not to listen… none of this should have happened, and I’m not sure where we go from here.
I could talk forever about your role as Nancy on Roseanne, because that was such a memorable and important time for me and the queer folks of my generation! But you’ve already talked about the ups and downs of that run so many times. I was just wondering what your reaction was to her supposedly filming a “secret” comedy series that will likely be influenced by her recent MAGA-friendly philosophies?
I had an incredible time on Roseanne, and I’m not sure where her head is at now. I don’t know anything about this new project.
What do you think about that whole Joe Rogan / Theo Vonn bro comedy podcast scene? Shane Gillis, who’s from that world, was widely criticized recently for a monologue that some called sexist and homophobic, while others just dismissed it as unfunny. Are these bros setting us back to the Comedy Stone Age, or are they doing important stuff?
Important? Clearly not. Who knows what any of these guys really believe or feel? Luckily, I don’t really pay attention to any of them.
Speaking of SNL, I recently heard a rumor tha you and Catherine O’Hara were almost cast members during that big cast change in the early 80s.
No, I was never considered for SNL… and of course, SCTV to me was far superior to SNL–truly brilliant and so damn funny. I adored Catherine… so, so sad she’s gone.
Who’s inspiring you these days, in comedy or any entertainment?
I adore Lola Young and Lana Del Rey, and was deeply moved by DTF St Louis. I’m very happy Lena Dunham is back, and Ilana Glazer is always funny… these are some of people who come to mind.
Do you still enjoy December holiday vibes?
From Thanksgiving through New Years Eve, this is one of my favorite times of the year. the food, gathering, emotions, I love it
You’ve been doing late December shows at the Public Theater’s Joe’s Pub for 20 years… which means you’ve always been working on New Year’s Eve! Do you ever miss just being a guest at a bar or party as the ball drops, or was that never your thing?
I do not like parties on NYE; I want to create the party. So I do that every year–to set the intentions for the coming year, and sum up that last one, It has great meaning to me, and I hope I can bring everyone together with good vibes.
Folks love your seasonal shows, and your latest “Sandy Spectacular!: 20 Years of Sandy at Joe’s Pub” runs December 26th through the 31st! Tell us what makes these shows so special in general, and what we can expect from this particular show!
I keep thinking I’ll do classic pieces, but in the end I’m always inspired to write new material. It’s a challenge, but also an inspiration, to keep creating and going deep. So expect new material, songs, and a look at where we’ve been and where we’re headed.
What else is coming up for you?
I’m a part of the new LOEWE holiday campaign that we shot in June in Sofia, Bulgaria! Jordan Firstman is in it as well, and we had very fun time.
Looking forward to that! Finally, it’s been a very well-traversed topic with you… but I can’t not ask you a Madonna thing! Have you listened to Confessions II, and what are your thoughts if you have?
Always fun, and keeping her dancing and energy sharp. She’s one of the greats at this, and the leader of the pack… still keeping everyone on the edge of their seat!
As are you! Thanks, Sandra!
Check Thotyssey’s calendar for Sandra Bernhard’s upcoming area appearances, and follow her on Facebook, Instagram, LinkTree, Spotify and her website. Listen to her show “Sandyland” on Sirius FX.
